If we can somehow vest it and stake it at the same time the risk is lower for the buyers!
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You might want to do the most basic level of due diligence about what Derek is up to before making a comment like that. Heās currently working on a project which is truly significant, with the intention of benefitting $APE.
You seem to be making some logical leaps that are pretty far off the mark from my perspective. Not wanting to buy or hold a specific coin, and believing that people who do hold (and in many cases have for a long time) must be unintelligent are two very, very different things. Intelligent people can hold opposing viewpoints. Itās actually very common. Logical fallacies (your statement is a straw man) are not an example of being intellectually honest.
Also FWIW if I was able to buy $APE at a 50 to 75% discount, I would sell it all immediately. An instant, basically risk free gain of 25 to 50% is an opportunity Iāll always take. I havenāt seen what I need to see, thus far, to believe that $APE is on a path to a sustainable future. I have seen a lot of very questionable things that lead me to believe thereās a long road to go down before things improve. If weāre being objective, the performance of $APE over time is one of the worst of any coin in crypto that has legitimate purpose and backing.
Of course more power to anyone that does believe things will improve and want to hold. I do agree that rewarding people who put time into staying active here, over the course of months and years, is nice. I donāt personally expect anything. I maintain activity here because itās quite the fascinating ride.
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You can find more info here:
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Thatās utterly ridiculous; to say the least.
For the record, this is what I said. I encourage you to read it again. Slowly this time.
āPlus, people who can afford to buy that amount in tokens are smart enough not to buy $ape at this point, then just hodl. Reason being the token has no utility and thereās no catalyst for it to pump. And no, ApeChain isnāt going to do that in the short-term. And so, theyāre going to buy it at discount and immediately dump it.ā
I see that @chimperton has already addressed the very same points that I would have made, and so, I wonāt belabor those points.
Investors buy assets for a variety of reasons. Lets ignore standard investments for a minute, and lets focus on Web3 where memecoins are a thing. Few people buy NFTs because they like them, while others buy them as an investment vehicle for staking, hodling etc. At the end of the day, itās either for profit or for holdings.
Anyone who bought and held from day one, did so for a variety of reasons. In fact, from the charts, a lot of people dump massive amounts during unlocks, during price action etc. Not to mention our own elections whereby weeks ahead of elections people bulk up on $ape, then dump immediately after the elections. These are all facts.
This is $ape right now:
How many smart people do you believe were inclined to intentionally hodl all the way to $0.63?
While youāre at it, as of this moment, for as many million token wallets and holders out there, fewer than 150K actually hold $ape.
So, let me ask you:
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Why you believe that a smart person would buy $ape at $0.63 via a 75% discount - with the purpose of hodling it?
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Why you believe that a smart person would buy a depreciating asset thatās likely to settle around $0.28 within +109D - with the purpose of hodling it?
Investors buy assets for a variety of reasons and mostly they donāt give a toss about āda cultureā or āda clubā or any of that because those are different things. Buy a painting to put on your wall or to take a tax cut or to sell via your gallery. Buy stocks to leave for your children or to trade. My point being people buy assets for different reasons, and smart people will never - ever - knowingly buy a depreciative asset of any kind for the sole purpose of watching it die a slow death. And for good measure, most smart people who knowingly do that, usually do it as a tax harvesting move.
As a smart person, I know the difference between commitment and investment.
As someone who has been in many social communities over the decades, none of them required my financial investment in order to āvalidateā my commitment and/or motivations.
Also, I tend not to join cults; and so, my commitment to communities isnāt tied to my bank account.
Similarly, of the 150K wallets that hold $ape, even if we went with the standard 18% margin for duplication (people with more than 1 wallet holding it), less than an avg of 300 vote in the DAO.
And those who donāt care about the community collectively hold over $400M worth of $ape - including the Apes who were airdropped over 150M and promptly dumped it. How much of the number do you believe are individuals (not institutions) who care about the community? And to that end, is their financial commitment somehow more valuable that ours because weāre smart enough not to hold a depreciating asset for no good reason?
The notion that not holding $ape is tantamount to ādonāt want to invest to have APE to have more impactā is complete nonsense which a smart person would immediately discard out of hand because there is zero evidence to suggest that holding $ape gives it more āimpactā. to wit: as I type this, that āimpactā is akin to a smoldering crater in someoneās wallet holdings.
People in communities tend to contribute in various ways. Thatās how that works.
That you believe buying the token at discount and even with a vesting schedule is somehow a smart thing, tells me that you clearly donāt understand how math works. I mean, the evidence is right there in the historical charts, but yet still you believe that doing so at this moment in time is totally a smart play.
The same goes for me; aside from the fact that every single post that I make, every single action that I take, is in furtherance of improving the DAO and helping it forge a path towards profitability and prosperity. I have asked for nothing in return because I am old school like that.
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Either your spare time is at max levels, or you are able to ship this stuff off the top of the dome.
Either way, I am ready and able to say I think there are a lot of smart points being made.
Iām only smart enough to admit I donāt understand it all.
I do think strong participation should be rewarded. I donāt want people rushing to sell and sending us to zero.
I know itās down. But I have hope ApeChain will provide necessary use cases that will be beneficial.
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POINTS FOR CONSIDERATION & INCLUSION:
Vesting/staggered release of $ape.
How to incorporate & reward more groups of contributors - are there any more?.
Reduce the amount of $ape to be sold.
Reduce the reduction percentage.
Conduct surveys.
Bespoke option needed or off the shelf still applicable. Costs associated.
As a dev, most of my āspareā time is derived from the fact that I have been semi-retired since 2021 after creating stellar teams that I donāt babysit; and also because when I find myself coding, due to the complexity of most of the work that I do, there are long spells in between things like designs, flowing, build (like watching paint dry) times. Plus, I think and type faster than normal. 
Yes - I believe that we all can agree on that.
However, our DAO doesnāt have ANY method by which all members are rewarded for doing anything. The AIP process isnāt about reward because thatās not how rewards tend to work. The same goes for ThankApe and whatever it is the GwG have going over at their grants program.
Fact is, OG Apes were already rewarded to the tune of $150M almost 2.5 yrs ago - and a good number of them sold, while others bought the dip over the years. Thatās the nature of the Web3 beast.
I have been harping about rewarding the community for a very long time, and to my knowledge, there isnāt a single program or project that isnāt about gains for the creators while giving nothing back to the community. Itās why I spent almost a month working on the AIP-487: ApeCoin Community Engagement Platform ACE project before posting here back on July 8th. I later withdrew it after being encouraged to send it through the Banana Bill due to its premise and costs. From top to bottom, the platform has a rewards program purely for participation and which is tied to a token. In its simplest form, all you have to do in order to be rewarded is to just show up. Thatās it.
And as the ACE token is designed to be a spot to $ape it will also intrinsically help $ape. And guess what happens if we do something foolish like putting a swath of [discounted] tokens in the hands of speculators who care more about money than they do about the community? Theyāre going to dump it. Sure, some are likely to hold, but they are smart enough not to buy a large amount solely to hodl it. Given how down bad most hodlers are, anyone telling me that theyāre likely to buy large amounts at this discount and hodl are either lying or theyāre exceptionally foolish.
I donāt think hopium is going to cut it.
What gives you this hope? What have you seen in the on-going ApeChain process that indicates it has thus far done better than the swath (over 100 coming in the next few months?
Iāve been saying it for quite some time - and to the ApeChain/BB people - that there are a lot of L2s with lots of funding, marketing, organization, much larger teams etc. coming. Even Garga is aware of this.
To be clear, this isnāt me looking to FUD or fade ApeChain, these are just the facts. And after all Iām one of the few out there thatās actually talking about it while also looking to build something on it for the betterment of the community.
Though this isnāt the thread for it, while weāre on the subject of ApeChain, I am going to say this again - and as clear as I can for those who arenāt privy to my social media posts (for example this and this) or private discussions:
ApeChain is starting behind the curve. Itās facing headwinds which, in tech (I have been in long enough to know) can be largely insurmountable (to say the least). From what I have seen thus far, knowing that I am not privy to behind-the-scenes dealings, while we have a few partners (roads) lined up, we would still need cars (dApps) and people (users). And anyone who thinks that memecoins, which are all but dead atm, are going to be the future of key ApeChain adoption, are either the very same speculators or theyāre just being ignorant. Games? Donāt even get me started. Mesariās latest reports/metrics for game tokens was recently released and theyāre just as bad as memecoins.
New gaming token listings and average performance as of 8/9:
- Q3 2023: 6 new gaming tokens / -9%
- Q4 2023: 10 new gaming tokens / -85%
- Q1 2024: 18 new gaming tokens / -76%
- Q2 2024: 24 new gaming tokens / -59%
Itās not just gaming tokens that took a hit, itās all alts. On Binance, since the start of 2024 through 8/9: non-gaming new token listings are down 51.3% on average versus gaming new token listings down 62.7% on average
All this is to say, selling the token at a discount isnāt only going to exacerbate the tokenās state but also has the potential to also adversely affect ApeChain due to sell pressure. I mean, back when BB was funded to the tune of $100M, $ape was around $0.80. Since then it has dipped and fluctuated by over 30% and currently struggling to even stabilize at $0.60. And itās only going to get worse once the upcoming proposals, including those going through BB, are funded and need to convert to fiat to fund the projects. And the Foundation and BB holding off on funding proposals due to the price of the token presents a Catch-22 because thatās how you lose - especially in the case of BB for which that first $60M (of the $100M) tranche is suddenly looking a lot like $80M.
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Need to revisit this. Def have some answers. But about to board a flight.
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This topic was automatically closed after 7 days. New replies are no longer allowed.
Hi ApeCoin DAO Community,
@furiousanger has requested to withdraw their application. This AIP will be moved to and remain in the Withdrawn AIPs category.
Kind Regards,
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