Reverting the Default ApeCoin Discourse Theme Back to Classic

[AllCityBAYC]

Maybe I’m sounding a bit old-school here, but given the maturation happening within the ApeCoin ecosystem, I think it’s time we took a hard look at shifting back to a more efficient Forum design.

While the current theme may look fun at first, I find that a more classic approach that’s optimized better for mobile and a higher level of professionalism may be the move.

For perspective, here are a few examples from the Arbitrum ecosystem that to me, provide a far more polished and user-friendly experience.

AC

[LOR3LORD]

@AllCityBAYC

les from the Arbitrum ecosystem that to me, provide a far more polished and user-friendly experience.

I feel like I just got comfortable with the current format lol. But if it makes things easier, who am I to get in the way?

[VonFrontin]

Agree w/ @LOR3LORD that I’ve also gotten used to it, but it’s not about me. It’s about the next wave of $APEs.

[bigbull]

I prefer the old theme especially for mobile.

Maybe we need an option when people join, like how trading sites have a standard and advanced version.

Power users probably like the advanced version.

Also this suggestion wouldn’t remove the newly created version, just change the default or better give a choice to new users.

[AllCityBAYC]

To be fair and elaborate a bit further, @LOR3LORD and @VonFrontin—a lot of effort went into this theme, but people have had trouble from the start getting the mobile version to operate properly.

Core functions, like the chat feature on my mobile device, won’t work because the screen locks and doesn’t cascade properly, so I can’t see anything that I’m trying to type, which is a significant issue. I actually find the chat feature confusing as a whole and am not sure that it’s needed, given that we can easily DM one another. I also encounter a variety of problems with notifications, which seem to have a mind of their own. So when onboarding newcomers, bugs like these reflect poorly on the entire ecosystem and make us look unprofessional.

Another concern is the focus on ApeKin, who I’ve grown to like. From an artistic perspective, it’s an awesome character. However, for newcomers or casual onlookers who could potentially join our community, ApeKin may be confusing as they don’t know what it is. This also feels like a missed opportunity to reinforce our branding. Instead of increasing our brand frequency, we may be diluting it a little.

Just my two cents, and to reiterate BigBull’s comment above: I’m not suggesting we drop the theme entirely, but rather make it an opt-in choice for those who want it. This would help ensure a clean experience with fewer bugs for newcomers, allowing us to make the best possible lasting impressions that we need to be taken seriously. I’d even be fine with having a pinned post on the forum landing page with instructions on how to switch to this format, as that could also encourage interactive engagement.

Also worth noting that the GWG ran a Community Governance Improvement Program challenge with rewards to a group of ApeCoin DAO beta testers, which found a variety of bugs that were fixed afterward because of it. But at what point do we recognize that we may be simply settling for a product that is not working properly versus reverting back to something that we know does?

Anyways, just my two cents, and of course, as always, eager to hear what others think on the topic.

AC

[VonFrontin]

I understand and agree with the thought process.

It’s not to discredit any work that has gone into making Discourse more approachable.

I still use the OG black theme. It was cumbersome to learn but I figured it out.

That said, my point was just that we should focus less on what current members think and focus more on what helps attract and retain new members.

If there are options we could test with non or newer DAO members, that would be great because it would allow us to get outside of our bubble.

[bigbull]

If they come from other DAOs then the Original theme will be easier.

Examples.

ENS DAO Governance Forum

Arbitrum

[VonFrontin]

So then I guess that’s the question: who is our target audience for new DAO members?

Are we targeting people from other DAOs or people looking for their first DAO?

That would help direct us on how we should be approaching not just website design but also broader messaging and promotional efforts.

[bigbull]

Yes, however, it is worth noting, many plugins are battle tested on the default theme. So using a new theme will sometimes give unexpected results on a custom theme.

[VonFrontin]

Totally understand. That’s a trade off we’d have to consider if we went down another direction.

[chimperton]

@AllCityBAYC

Another concern is the focus on ApeKin, who I’ve grown to like. From an artistic perspective, it’s an awesome character. However, for newcomers or casual onlookers who could potentially join our community, ApeKin may be confusing as they don’t know what it is. This also feels like a missed opportunity to reinforce our branding. Instead of increasing our brand frequency, we may be diluting it a little.

The problem with this statement is that ApeKin is supposed to be a part of the branding. It’s why ApeKin exists. One could easily push back on this and say if your statement is true, then that’s an education issue which can be solved.

But I think the new theme is fine. It’s generally easier for me to quickly see updated topics this way. A lot of these various sub-forums have zero activity and don’t really matter, so the OG theme style that’s decades old in design style, isn’t from my perspective solving an actual problem. It boils down to personal preference. You could run usability research to have a refined point of view if you really want to have a firm opinion backed by qualitative data.

[LOR3LORD]

@AllCityBAYC

Core functions, like the chat feature on my mobile device, won’t work because the screen locks and doesn’t cascade properly, so I can’t see anything that I’m trying to type, which is a significant issue. I actually find the chat feature confusing as a whole and am not sure that it’s needed, given that we can easily DM one another. I also encounter a variety of problems with notifications, which seem to have a mind of their own. So when onboarding newcomers, bugs like these reflect poorly on the entire ecosystem and make us look unprofessional.

So, I have a very DUMB question, that I genuinely do not know the answer to: Would it be possible to create an ApeCoinDAO App?

My guess is that it wouldn’t work because you could not connect your wallet to it? I’m not sure of the mechanics to be honest.

But apps, in general, are much easier to use, than opening a browser, and using a website.

Is it cost prohibitive ? Something to do with iPhone users? Just curious. Thank you.

[bigbull]

There is an app already. I use that most days.

[AllCityBAYC]

Good points here as well, and always appreciate my dawg Matt Borchert’s opinion on anything ApeCoin DAO-related.

Regarding the Forum look, I don’t feel like we need to be cookie-cutter just for the sake of fitting in or looking like others. This is ApeCoin, and ApeCoin is about culture and community, unlike most other primarily crypto-focused DAOs or protocols.

That said, my concerns about the bugs—and how they affect both the appearance and functionality of our primary governance platform—remain. In my opinion, governance should, by default, equate to reliability, consistency, and tried-and-true processes, platforms, and procedures.

As for the ApeKin topic, while I agree it’s more of a messaging issue, it goes beyond just marketing. Branding and appearance aren’t just about advertisements; they form our identity. These decisions reflect our direction and require significant financial resources and efforts to make real, which must be approved and deployed by the powers that be.

That being said, I also believe that decision-making like this shouldn’t rest solely on the Foundation or the community. It requires professional guidance from highly strategic and creative minds who understand human psychology and the impact of visuals on long-term sustainability and marketability, which translates to growth. Or in other words, a seasoned agency.

In summary: this is a great discussion with no wrong perspective and should be treated similar to a focus group, providing feedback to professionals who can offer opinions, projections and options to the DAO based on discussions like this combined with proven theories and historical results.

Just my two cents, but again, love the convo.

AC

[AllCityBAYC]

I’ve always wanted to see a native app built specifically for ApeCoin.

It was actually one of my campaign points when I was first elected to Governance back in mid-2023, and I brought it up again in a later GWG budget. Also, while BigBull is correct that there is a Discourse app available, I’d still love to see a more robust, ApeCoin-specific product created, even if just a quality PWA.

I also have a feeling we’re not alone in wanting this, and improving the overall web experience is likely something the Foundation is considering, especially given the outstanding job they’ve done with the ApeChain website and its launch

Top marks all around!!

AC

[chimperton]

@AllCityBAYC

That said, my concerns about the bugs—and how they affect both the appearance and functionality of our primary governance platform—remain. In my opinion, governance should, by default, equate to reliability, consistency, and tried-and-true processes, platforms, and procedures.

Agree.

@AllCityBAYC

That being said, I also believe that decision-making like this shouldn’t rest solely on the Foundation or the community. It requires professional guidance from highly strategic and creative minds who understand human psychology and the impact of visuals on long-term sustainability and marketability, which translates to growth. Or in other words, a seasoned agency.

This is what I do professionally, but on the usability side. I guess I’d have bigger questions about the overall goals of Discourse, how it is or isn’t measuring up to those goals, and what the expected outcomes will be. Which is to say, a larger conversation. My general impression on the brand aspect is that the DAO, just like $APE, has a very split audience with very split goals. To hyper simplify, you have the people who want $APE and the DAO to be all about Yuga and only Yuga, and then you have a group that want it to be a coin / DAO that brings multiple communities together under one umbrella. I fall into the second camp of not wanting it to be Yuga-centric. But neither here or there, I just think it’s been a long-term identity crisis.

[AllCityBAYC]

Full disclosure, I’d love to see ApeCoin take on the new ApeChain look… Font with the box around it — everything.

Wouldn’t mean we phase out the OG skull and font, but they would be viewed as more of a retro thing.

AC

[LOR3LORD]

@bigbull

There is an app already. I use that most days.

This is great. I did not know this was also an app. But I think I was thinking more ApeCoin specific. Probably wouldnt work. Need to connect to snapshot somehow.

[VonFrontin]

Agreed. ApeChain branding is very clean.

I don’t mind the skull. You need to have a brand icon and it’s a banger IMO.

Also need to determine from a branding standpoint if it makes sense to differentiate the coin from the chain or have it all together.

[furiousanger]

@chimperton

But neither here or there, I just think it’s been a long-term identity crisis.

I see so many “nothing ideas” wasting everyone’s time and efforts here. Yet the major questions which need answering, and issues we must face, seem to only briefly appear within threads - then lost in the ether.

Apes make us great, but they’re also what hinder us at times.

For me how the rebranding drive takes place - at what time and cost - will determine if majority agree and make it happen, without massive fallout and damage.

Tl;dr - let’s get the conversation going at the right time; not sure if that time is now with apechain launch imminent, but maybe it is.

Side note - maybe we auction off the skull NFT to raise funds for the DAO after the change happens.