Web3 Gaming & ApeDAO

This is kinna sorta an offshoot of an @0xSword thread,
my previous thread,
and thoughts from @Apeancestor

An important proposal attempting to bridge web3 and web2 gaming is in NounsDAO right now. Only the second viable one I’ve seen. The first one was actually in this DAO; there just wasn’t enough lead time on it to work. Bygones. We’ll revisit that later.

Normie gamers still hate anything web3 and NFT. And with good reason. A thread on that; tl;dr, they got hosed thinking they were gonna ball out. :joy:

As an insider, I’ve got a front row seat to the problems on the web2-web3 gaming bridge. You see a lot of those problems coming to light on the Nouns-Weplay thread. This analysis is all about exposing and fixing those problems, so when we come back with a legit gaming event proposal for this DAO, everybody can be super confident in the partnership and in the plan to bring real results.

The players:

Nouns — Leading DAO in terms of successfully decentralizing operations; going through growing pains
Weplay — Legit esports events company; a few critiques concerning lowbrow sponsors, but honestly, that’s just part of the game

The ask:

Weplay throws a $1M DOTA tourney for Nouns.

Weplay’s presentation was fantastic; no issues there. They showed their work and they have the deliverables track record.

So what’s the problem?

Nouns internal issues aside, the problem is with the esports industry. Nobody’s cracked the code to profitability, though everyone sees potential. Right now, big companies like Red Bull and Nike are treating events like the Weplay pitch as a social impact partnership. They’ve got the budget to spend on speculative marketing, so they make their mark in the emergent industry of esports. If it doesn’t work out in 5 years, no real skin off their back. If it does, we get our 1000X first-mover profits and a cultural moat that future proofs our brand to youth consumers.

What’s this got to do with ApeDAO?

Profitability’s not prioritized in the DAO during the Transition away from Cartan. It will be, and very soon.

ApeDAO’s the biggest DAO treasury in web3, and it’s an order of magnitude below what Red Bull or Nike can easily spend. Nobody’s going for a single event that costs $1M with an audience that hates our guts anyway.

But… events like this are still the best way to create the hype wave that closes the web2-web3 gamer gap.

So how do you capture this market and stay profitable, too?

The Answer
Create a SUSTAINABLE relationship between the DAO and the audience. This is what the Weplay-Nouns pitch is missing. There’s no tail. No follow up. Nothing to say to that DOTA audience, “Here’s our app; here’s our NFT; here’s our game you can play on Day 1 after the event concludes. Join our community!” Only do business with organizers who will work with you after the event to cultivate that audience to the DAO. Better yet, a series of events. That’s a cultural infusion.

Step 2: Multiple sponsors.
ApeDAO shouldn’t be “leading the round.” Weplay wants Nouns to foot the whole bill. Maybe 3 years from now, that makes sense. Right now, do events with web2 sponsors who carry the heavy load. ApeDAO gets on the bill, shows up with a contingent, and gets the same amount of exposure for way less money. So $1M lead rounds, no. $100K-350K with Nike or Red Bull also on the bill giving $1M — that’s a solid investment.

Three: Get KPIs, please.
There’s gotta be some kind of deliverables other than social media views or event day foot traffic. Those aren’t the most important KPIs to a virtual DAO, anyway. The KPIs are new wallets created, total face time with audience, logo screen time. Work with the organizer to come up with KPIs that are actually relevant. You get those, you get results.

4 — most important: The tech stack has to be right.
It doesn’t matter how much the audience likes your web3 offering if the web2 event organizers don’t have the technical capacity to bridge their audience to the DAO. More than that — the tech stack to create a sustainable cultural link between the audience and the DAO. How many esports companies have a web3 app with a wallet ready to receive $APE? (I know of one, but that’s for later. :grin:) Point is, the reason the results look garbage is because the bridge wasn’t complete to begin with.

Keeping this discussion alive so real projects are ready to go after the governance gets worked out. 2023 has the potential to be an exciting year, but only if each one of us decides that we each have a responsibility to make that excitement happen.

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Hey Mantis Bro,

Let me quote what you said “we get our 1000X first-mover profits and a cultural moat that future proofs our brand to youth consumers.

What’s this got to do with ApeDAO?

Profitability’s not prioritized in the DAO during the Transition away from Cartan. It will be, and very soon.”

If we see profitability is eventually a priority for ApeDAO, a marketing working group would be needed and work constantly to promote the usage of the $APE coin as the utility vehicle on the Otherside Metaverse web3 gaming.

Daniel Alegre is now CEO of Yuga Labs, the former gaming exec president and COO from Activision Blizzard. I am extremely excited to see how Daniel will lead the team YugaLabs to the next phase of growth for the Otherside Metaverse NFT and Gaming development.

IMO, WG0 in Marketing of ApeDAO can do something as well. Maybe arrange annually;

BAYC Otherside Metaverse Game Developers Conference

  • Organizer would be ApeCoin DAO
  • Fund by ApeCoin Foundation
  • Invite some APE celebrities to promote the event as special speakers

Organize and schedule the conference in 3 different continents if possible.

  1. America (Las Vegas before Christmas 2023)
  2. Europe (London during the new year 2024)
  3. Asia (Hong Kong or Singapore, during Chinese New Year 2024)

Third, can think about how to attract Game Developers to join the ApeCoin orbit and ecosystem with incentives and memorable prizes.

  1. Give out free Yachts Club House one year membership on the Otherside of the Metaverse.
  2. Free Otherside Game developers SDK tools
  3. Free Lottery tickets to have a change to win a BAYC Ape as 1st price, Mutant Ape as 2nd price, and 3rd a Otherside deed with a Koda.

Again, the ApeCoin community is pretty amazing, and I love joining such working group if ApeCoin DAO will ever have such initiatives!

Ken

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Two different issues. Doesn’t matter how much $APE gets marketed if the DAO doesn’t get any of it. I’m talking about DAO revenue streams, not marketing $APE.

Good for all of us, but the DAO is not Yuga. I’m worried about what I can do, not what he does.

So yeah, I want plans for the DAO specifically, and the post was about web2 companies partnering with the DAO. I think it’s important to remember the DAO has the ability to do plenty outside of Yuga and have its own branding.

Third, can think about how to attract Game Developers to join the ApeCoin orbit and ecosystem with incentives and memorable prizes.

This is definitely important. You should see if any of it fits in the AIP we’re putting together. AIP Draft — Degen Prop House (DPH) - Google Docs

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Question:
Any reason you created a new discussion when I already started one?
If you would post it as a response with you all thought to the initial one - it would be more United. So people I sent it too in messages could read it already.
It is the same topic.
How about we combine it into one?

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I don’t mean to step on anyone’s toes, but this topic is specific, about the Nouns-Weplay esports pitch. Yours is about Otherside gaming. This is talking about the DAO, not Yuga.

Honestly, Otherside threads are better placed directly in front of Yuga and the Otherside specific groups, because to get anything done there, you will have to go through them. Important to remember that Yuga and the DAO are two completely separate entities, even if they both have the ability to be involved in gaming.

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Yes its 2 separate entities) I know)
We can develop games to bring value to ApeCoin holders as well as Oherside specific developments.

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For sure, and one of the major ideas I’m imprinting now is what buidler audience the DAO focuses on as opposed to Otherside.

The big question everyone asks is, “Should the DAO wait on Otherside to pursue gaming, because Otherside is going to take all the attention anyway?”

My answer is no, because the DAO shouldn’t compete with Otherside.

Otherside will definitely gather a large number of high quality builders. But the opportunities will be limited. Deed holders are going to hire people they know and studios with a track record.

What’s more, the content coming out of Otherside will undoubtedly be Ape-centered, as it should be.

This leaves the door wide open for the DAO to fund talented enthusiast builders with ideas that don’t fit Otherside. If you want to draw more people into the DAO, let them connect their efforts to yours without trying to define them too much. (There are orders of magnitude more builders with interest in their own ideas than there are with interest in Apes. Interest in Ape-centered content also drops precipitously the further away you get from the center of Ape ownership.)

Otherside will be the Yugacentric gaming hub, and the DAO can be for everything else.

So when Otherside comes out, DAO Gaming is not competing with Otherside. ApeDAO games competes with the $MAGIC ecosystem and the NFA ecosystem, e.g.

Degen Prop House (DPH) is centered around capturing this enthusiast builder audience — thinking ahead to the time when Otherside is a reality so the DAO can make its own mark in gaming. DPH targets talented enthusiasts to build proofs-of-concept that 1. bring more talent to us, 2. define the DAO in gaming separate from Yuga, and 3. give the DAO content to market to attract even more talent.

Check it out. DPH should be ready to roll as soon as Governance and Operations get worked out. We need a plan of attack as soon as the Transition is over to make ApeDAO #1.

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People don’t know that this DAO can actualloy fund builders so we need to spread this word.

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Should we have enough interest and create a team working together for write up AIP regarding this this proposal? IMO, this is the best way to spread the message across the gaming industry.

Please DM me if you have interest as one of the Authors, so we can work together.

BAYC Otherside Metaverse Game Developers Conference

  • Organizer would be ApeCoin DAO
  • Fund by ApeCoin Foundation
  • Invite some APE celebrities to promote the event as special speakers

Organize and schedule the conference in 3 different continents if possible.

  1. America (Las Vegas before Christmas 2023)
  2. Europe (London during the new year 2024)
  3. Asia (Hong Kong or Singapore, during Chinese New Year 2024)

Third, can think about how to attract Game Developers to join the ApeCoin orbit and ecosystem with incentives and memorable prizes.

  1. Give out free Yachts Club House one year membership on the Otherside of the Metaverse.
  2. Free Otherside Game developers SDK tools
  3. Free Lottery tickets to have a change to win a BAYC Ape as 1st price, Mutant Ape as 2nd price, and 3rd a Otherside deed with a Koda.

Again, the ApeCoin community is pretty amazing, and I love joining such working group if ApeCoin DAO will ever have such initiatives!

Ken

2 Likes

Update on the Weplay-Nouns proposal, because following this development is good to understand how ApeDAO can get great value out of gaming partnerships.

It failed. Like, pretty hard fail, too.

As a gaming/esports company owner myself, you hate to see it, but there’s reasons why:

1. Selling single-event hype is no longer the meta. Weplay throws great events. There’s no question about this. Action Slacks is well within his rights to ask for $1M for production — that’s actually lowballing.

Here’s the problem: Everyone on the web2 and web3 side of a Nouns-Weplay DOTA tourney would go bonkers for that day for sure. Noggles! DOTA! …NOTA! But without any follow through, Nouns wouldn’t be any more integrated into web2 gaming than the day before. There’s no onboarding plan.

And they know that, so they voted it down even though the event would have been spectacular.

2. The new way is nano. Overall, big hype events don’t sell the way they used to. You want to get an idea out, the nanoinfluencer (under 100 subs) / microinfluencer (under 1000 subs) is the way. It’s MUCH better to have 100 micromarketers with a total of 100,000 subs than one influencer with 100,000 subs.

Why?

Many reasons, but the main one is you’re paying influencers for that sub number, while you pay nanoinfluencers for their actual REACH. Influencer channels with 100,000 subs get like 7,000-8,000 per video. Your reach is really 8,000, not 100,000. But those nanos… they get higher real impact. They might only have 1,000 subs, but the engagement percentage is much higher because they’re closer to their audience.

Plus, it’s better to have 100 videos about $APE than 1 video about $APE. The algorithm on major social media platforms starts to work for you more quickly in the former case.

I don’t expect Nouns knew any of this. But there’s a general sense in the air that huge hype events are 90% hot air. Main reason — it’s true. If you can get over nanoinfluencers being decidedly more unsexy than getting Ghostface Killah to market your stuff, then you will have a better, more sustained marketing campaign to really align $APE with gaming.

Moral of the story? Big events must have an event tail that focuses on getting the word out about $APE through nanoinfluencers. This is what will work in the gaming space.

Thoughts?

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At the macro my take is that we need to enable events to run on $APE at every level. Production payments, tickets, concessions, souvenirs, prize purses, etc.

Make it easy to send and receive $APE and onboard every single participant at every level of the event into the ecosystem.

We should just work out a partnership with Cash App, Venmo, PayPal, etc. to give people the least friction on-ramp into holding and spending $APE around any DAO related events.

Then incentivize them through subsidies the same way credit card companies give free money for sign up and usage.

@ZastrowBradley spoke about reducing friction around $APE usage in his SC platform. Figuring out the best way to do this will have outsize benefits for every single event proposal.

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I want to see Apecoin payments everywhere!

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Most definitely… I would also love to lead that outreach into web3 partners as well. The smaller banks like Filda and ForTube that can expand $APE to builders/producers who lend and borrow in web3 to fund themselves. The web3 portion is definitely a smaller scale than doing Paypal partnerships, but also important because this is where the exponential growth will be.

If $APE wants to be the coin of the metaverse, it’s gotta also partner up with the web3 banks that are powering the metaverse!

I also wonder if @ssp1111 is pursuing the $APE enablement you speak of as a priority of the IRL Events group.

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Heyo @Mantis

$APE enablement is one of the mandates for all our Local Champions as much as is feasibly possible. Our ticketing partner, enter.xyz is also making $APE as a payment option.

We figure it’s a slow and steady ramp-up for $APE and will make it an option at every reasonable touch-point.

Would be glorious if you were able to get the Venmo, Cash Apps and PayPals of the world to integrate $APE and would love for a Treasury Working Group to manage our grant (as an endowment) should our proposal even get to that point - kinda difficult to gauge the sentiment of the community and the Working Groups currently.

Thanks for all your boundary pushing.

Cheers,
SSP :v:t4:

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I love it. Having those partners will help to expand.

1 Like